tl;dr STIs and how to protect ourselves, men who want masturbation buddies, shame and fat bodies, plus Kobe Bryant’s death.

Patrons who support at $3 and above, there’s a new bonus at patreon.com/sgrpodcast tomorrow.

To kick off this week’s episode, we are exploring some of the complicated feelings around Kobe Bryant’s death, especially for survivors. We’re also unpacking a new paper released by the CDC about STIs being on the rise. Check out the article and report here: STDs on the rise: Cases of 3 common infections reach all-time highs in the US

Sinclair Sexsmith recently pulled together a bunch of people, blogs, and helpful tidbits on chronic pain and sex. Check out their Resources About Chronic Pain & Sex.

Then it’s on to your questions.

First up, Jose wants to know if it’s healthy to have a sexual relationship with himself when he’s in a relationship with someone else. And is it weird to want a masturbation buddy? Especially when he’s a straight man and wants to masturbate with other men?

Next, Busy Cat is ready to leave the big city and get a job in a smaller city, but her boyfriend isn’t ready to make the move. How can she convince him that this move will be good for them?

Finally, Ashamed is in recovery for an eating disorder and has complicated feelings about her fat body. She doesn’t have much experience with masturbation or sex, and she wants to start but she doesn’t know how.

What if you can’t reach your genitals? What if you don’t know where to start? We go all the places and focus in on pleasure – because that’s what it’s all about, right?

A huge thanks to the Vocal Few for their song in the opening and closing of the episode and to Hemlock for their awesome song “Firelight” which was used in this episode between questions.

Follow Sex Gets Real on Twitter and Facebook and Dawn is on Instagram.

About Dawn Serra:

What if everything you’ve been taught about relationships, about your body, about sex is wrong? My name is Dawn Serra and I dare to ask scary questions that might lead us all towards a deeper, more connected experience of our lives. In addition to being the host of the weekly podcast, Sex Gets Real, the creator of the online conference Explore More, I also work one-on-one with clients who are feeling stuck, confused, or disappointed with the ways they experience desire, love, and confidence. It’s not all work, though. In my spare time, you can find me adventuring with my husband, cuddling my cats as I read a YA novel, or obsessing over MasterChef Australia.

Listen and subscribe to Sex Gets Real

1. Listen and subscribe on iTunes
2. Check us out on Stitcher
3. Don’t forget about I Heart Radio’s Spreaker
4. Pop over to Google Play
5. Use the player at the top of this page.
6. Stream it on Spotify
7. Find the Sex Gets Real channel on IHeartRadio.

Hearing from you is the best

Contact form: Click here (and it’s anonymous)

Episode Transcript

Dawn Serra: You’re listening to Sex Gets Real with Dawn Serra, that’s me. This is a place where we explore sex, bodies, and relationships, from a place of curiosity and inclusion. Tying the personal to the cultural where you’re just as likely to hear tender questions about shame and the complexities of love, as you are to hear experts challenging the dominant stories around pleasure, body politics, and liberation. This is about the big and the small, about sex and everything surrounding it we don’t usually name. The funny, the awkward, the imperfect happen here in service to joy, connection, healing, and creating healthier relationships with ourselves and each other. So welcome to Sex Gets Real. Don’t forget to hit subscribe.

Welcome to another episode of Sex Gets Real. I have been super swamped working on Explore More Summit 2020 and it is shaping up to be fucking amazing, but it also means I’m a little late on releasing the episode. I hope you’ll forgive me. If you’re listening to this on release day, then you know today has been a tough, complicated day. In addition to growing concerns about the virus in China, Kobe Bryant, his daughter Gianna, and 7 others were killed in a helicopter accident in California. Just a little trigger warning, I am going to be mentioning an experience of rape, so that’s going to take a couple of minutes. If you want to skip ahead, if you need that, that’s okay.

Dawn Serra: A lot of people are posting about their complicated feelings about this. I want to invite us to sit inside of the messiness without pushing for answers or the need to be right. Kobe Bryant had a long career and inspired countless people during that time. So many current players grew up idolizing Kobe. He was a father to four daughters, three of whom survive his memory. The tragedy and the pain around his death are real. And, for so many survivors, stuff like this is hard. It was the same when David Bowie died, and so many others. 

I believe the woman who said Kobe raped her and held her against her will in his hotel room. Survivors know that fear and the entitlement that so many powerful people have towards other people’s bodies. The ways they objectify people they want something from. Kobe’s extraordinary wealth and resources helped make the problem disappear. Many people don’t even know about his abuse. He also yelled a gay slur at a ref during a game in 2011 out of anger, and it’s something most people would not say out of anger unless it was something they’ve said before.

Dawn Serra: People can do extraordinary, magical things and abuse others. People can be amazing parents and rape someone. People can inspire an entire generation of athletes and cause deep harm. All of it can be true. That’s the messiness of this reality. I can feel sad and angry. I can feel shocked and betrayed.

As the news continues to unfold, please check on your friends who are survivors. It can be deeply triggering to see so many people celebrating someone who didn’t really face accountability around the violence they caused. And for those of us who aren’t feeling triggered, who aren’t survivors, let us also send so much love and support to the Bryant family and the families of those on the helicopter who are facing enormous loss and grief. As well as the people who felt really connected to Kobe and what he offered to them. Allowing grief to be true does not decenter survivors and their pain. All of it is true. And, we’re asked to have the capacity to be able to hold that. Survivors, please take care of you whether that’s a social media break, asking for help, raging or grieving. We believe you.

Dawn Serra: OK, big breath. On today’s episode, we are going to dive into some things that I saved for you and we’re also going to dive into a few of your questions. Speaking of which, please email me if you could use some support, resources, validation, or advice. There’s a contact form at dawnserra.com and I would love to hear from you. You probably think I’m just talking generically out into the ether, in a way, I am. But I do mean YOU.

A couple of things that I saved so that I could share them with you: we’re going to start with STIs or sexually transmitted infections. Three months ago, the US Center for Disease Control and Prevention released a Sexually Transmitted Disease Surveillance Report. The findings are important, especially if you’re a teen or aged 20-29 age bracket.

Dawn Serra: The 2019 report analyzed 2018 data and found that it was the highest year of infection rates since data started being collected. Dr. Gail Bolan, director of the CDC’s Division of STD Prevention in the report, wrote, “Not that long ago, gonorrhea rates were at historic lows, syphilis was close to elimination, and we were able to point to advances in STD prevention. That progress has since unraveled. The number of reported syphilis cases is climbing after being largely on the decline since 1941, and gonorrhea rates are now increasing. Many young women continue to have undiagnosed chlamydial infections, putting them at risk for infertility.” That was from Dr. Gail Bolan in the report.

One of the major concerns that the CDC is outlining, which we’ve also been hearing coming out the U.K. and Australia, are the growing number of gonorrhea cases that are resistant to antibiotics. And if resistant strains of gonorrhea keep spreading, there is a risk that it could become an incurable strain. It’s also important to note that people who are pregnant, if you have syphilis and it’s untreated, the study says that over 1300 cases of congenital syphilis occurred last year – that’s when a pregnant person passes syphilis on to their baby at birth, and it resulted in 94 infant deaths. Syphilis is treatable, so if someone is pregnant or trying to become pregnant, it’s important to get a full STI screen, including for herpes. Because there can also be complications around herpes and birth, and there are treatments for that.

Dawn Serra: The report also says, and this is a quote, “That rates of reported gonorrhea cases last year were highest among teens and young adults, as were reported cases of chlamydia. For primary and secondary syphilis, cases were highest among adults ages 25 to 29.”

So, let’s talk about what this means. First, you are not wrong, bad, dirty, gross, unlovable, less sexy, or in any damaged if you have or have had an STI. Literally, the only reason there’s a stigma is because it relates to sex. If you’re around other humans, at some point in your life, you’ll end up with a cold or the flu or strep throat or pink eye and any number of other illnesses and diseases that get passed around because that’s just what human bodies do. Viruses like to travel and infections like to travel. That’s how they stay alive. Gonorrhea, syphilis, chlamydia, HIV, and HPV – they’re no different.

Dawn Serra: The flu is deadly to many people, but we don’t call someone’s worthiness into question when they have the flu. The same is true for syphilis or HIV. Support, rest, care, and treatment, that’s what we need and also communication. A big part of why STIs are on the rise is because stigma – the stigma is so prevalent. People would rather not know their status than know and potentially have to have a conversation about it. Because we’re terrified of communicating. And that’s not a great way to care for yourself or the people in your life. Also, sex education funding has been slashed, information about sex is becoming more and more difficult to find so it means fewer young people have access to the information they really need to make informed decisions about their bodies and sex. If you’re a teen or if you’re in your 20s, you are in the groups who are experiencing the biggest impact. So get tested, practice talking about sex and STIs with your friends so that it’s easier to do with dates and partners. And remember anyone who tries to push you to ignore a safer sex boundary does not deserve access to your body in any way.

If you have younger people in your life, talk to them. Talk to them about sex. Talk to them about pleasure. Talk to them about these incredible bodies that they have and all of the wonderful things that they can experience. Talk to them about their worth as a human being. Practice engaging in conversations that might feel awkward. Do it with other adults in front of them so that they can see adults doing it, and also talk to young people about it. So that they learn awkward isn’t going to kill them. Isn’t that a lesson all of us can use some practice with? Awkward isn’t going to kill us. And sometimes, amazing things are on the other side of awkward. 

Dawn Serra: Ensure that young people in your life have access to all of the safer sex supplies they might want and need. If you think a young person isn’t engaging in sexual activity, STILL make education and supplies are available to them. While most STIs are very treatable and manageable, we also don’t want to help gonorrhea become treatment resistant or incurable by helping it spread. Tell those germs to fuck off by getting tested regularly and by engaging in sex with barriers, by talking about your needs and asking people questions about the last time they were tested. 

This includes for oral sex, anal sex, intercourse. Barriers can be endlessly sexy, and don’t let anyone tell you otherwise. There are so many ways to make gloves and condoms, and all of that stuff so freaking hot. I’m going to link to the MSN piece on the CDC study for this episode at dawnserra.com/ep291/ for episode 291, if you want to check it out. I also, if you want something a little bit more fun, highly recommend watching the first episode of Season 2 of Sex Education on Netflix. The way Otis, the main character, helps to de-stigmatize and calm folks down around a potential gonorrhea outbreak at his school is wonderful. All of us, no matter how old we are, could learn so much from how he handles these conversations with his peers and shares practical information. We need more of that. So, way to go, pop culture, for helping to model the ways we could be having these conversations.

Dawn Serra: Up next, Sinclair Sexsmith recently pulled together a bunch of resources on chronic pain and sex. I’m going to link to it at dawnserra.com/ep291/ so you can follow all the people that Sinclair gathered up, read all the blog posts, follow all of this awesome work. Because so many people deal with chronic pain from migraines to serious injuries to disability and beyond. Finding ways to feel pleasure and sexual connection while experiencing chronic pain can be complicated and there are lots of people doing really awesome things out there, providing support and validation, and suggestions and ideas, and education. So be sure to check that out.

Our first email this week comes from Jose. It reads:

“Hi, Dawn. Do you think a strong sexual relationship with yourself is healthy when compared with a partner? Also… a little embarrassing here, but do you think it’s normal to want a male friend to masturbate with? Obviously, this won’t be able to happen as I am married, but it’s been something that I thought would be fun. I’m not interested in men. I didn’t think so anyway, but thought it would be kind of fun. I can’t imagine what I must sound like here, but I hope you might be able to shed some light for me. Thanks for all you do in the world. You make it more special than you realize. Jose.”

Dawn Serra: Hi Jose, thank you so much. I really appreciate the question because, interestingly, I’ve actually gotten 3 emails from guys, the past couple of weeks, all about this desire for masturbation buddy. So I don’t know if it’s the same person writing in multiple times or multiple people, and it just happens to be the question of the day kind of thing. But, let’s explore it.

First, a strong sexual relationship with yourself is so important! We all define that differently depending on our body, our desires, the lives we lead. But there’s something so important and valuable about being able to stay curious about our bodies and our sexualities, to touch ourselves, to fantasize. When we can remain curious, especially throughout the course of our lives, about our own pleasure, we’re better able to bring that curiosity and delight into partnered sex, too, if that’s something we do.

Dawn Serra: Each relationship is so different that when we think about being in relationship and having a sexual relationship with ourselves, it can be unique and nuanced depending on so many things. I think an example is, if you’re partnered and your partner doesn’t want to engage in partnered sex as often as you do, and you both have talked about that – it feels good, you’ve reached an understanding, so you spend time masturbating and delighting in your body and pleasure. That’s amazing. If you’re partnered and things are tense, maybe there’s old resentments or wounds, and instead of collaborating and healing together, you’re avoiding sex and avoiding problems by masturbating and hiding, then I’d say you probably would want to consider the health of your relationship and what kind of repair it needs. Because none of us should be hiding in our relationships. 

It’s OK to want private time, to masturbate on your own without announcing it to your partner, and it’s OK to share it, too. You and your partner get to decide what feels most nourishing and helpful for the both of you. But it’s worth talking about. Because some people who were raised inside of very sex negative cultures and households, maybe who were raised really religious, some see masturbation as a form of cheating, as something that is really shameful. And if you take delight in your body and in masturbating, and your partner sees that as a betrayal, there can be a lot of really hurt feelings around that. So being able to work through it and talk about it. Of course, you are allowed to delight in your body. Being able to really talk about that with a partner and to grow into that together can be a really wonderful thing. 

Dawn Serra: As for your other question, do you think it’s normal to want a male friend to masturbate with? Like I said, I’ve strangely gotten this question 3 times in the past couple of weeks from men. So, apparently, it’s a thing that people are having questions about right now. The answer is: Of course! Lots of folks would love to have platonic masturbation buddies and do. Some people love being watched. It’s not the person that turns them on or their gender so much as the act of being watched or caught. Some people just find that really hot. Other people love watching people touch themselves, and the gender and body parts may or may not matter. It’s more about the watching and feeling like you’re getting to see something private or getting to watch someone in their pleasure or maybe it feels taboo. Some people love that thought of doing something that’s naughty, and it’s the taboo that’s hot rather than that you’re attracted to men. Or it could be something else entirely. 

We have all sorts of fantasies because we’re gloriously complex creatures. Not everything necessarily means something about our sexuality or our past. Sometimes it just seems fun and that’s reason enough. If the thought of that is fun and hot, savor it. If you ever have the opportunity to try it, why not? You may find it’s just as hot as you imagined or you might find that the reality doesn’t live up to the fantasy. Both of those things are very common and normal responses to getting to experience a fantasy in real life. But either way, keep enjoying your body, savor your fantasies, and take time to ask what your relationship might also need to feel more nourished, tended, and cared for, too. I hope that’s helpful, Jose. Thank you so much for writing in and thanks for listening. 

Dawn Serra: This next question comes from Busy Cat. Busy Cat writes:

“Hello Dawn, I have been listening to your podcasts from London and I really really love your advice. I’m originally from Lisbon, Portugal and my boyfriend Flavio, is from Sardinia, Italy. I recently got a job proposal and that means moving outside London, which I have been wanting to do, but away from my boyfriend. I recently talked to him about if he wanted to move with me. The rent is cheaper, there’s less stress, it’s a small town. However, he keeps saying more cons than pros. Things like “I can’t come with you…” “If I don’t find a job, and if I need to commute”. Though, he has been pushing to move to another big city in the UK.

He is very insecure and indecisive and I am the complete opposite. We don’t live together yet, however we have been dating for over a year and I don’t want to play house anymore. How can I convince him that the move would benefit both of us without putting more pressure on our relationship? I’m just afraid if I move to a smaller town, it will put a strain in our relationship and we will be soon extinct. I look forward to hearing from you soon. From across the pond – lots of love, Busy Cat”

Dawn Serra: Hello, all the way in London, Busy Cat! Congratulations on the job proposal. That’s really exciting. It sounds like, from your email, moving to a small town outside of London is exactly what you’ve been wanting and now the possibility is really real. But it also sounds like your boyfriend is less sure about making that move. Ideally, you two would have worked this out before it got to the point where a job was being offered to you, because that does create pressure. Now there’s a time limit when something has to be decided.

When we want to make big changes that are going to impact the people in our lives, especially if we want them to come with us as we make those changes, it can take time to work through big feelings, to ensure everyone’s needs are being met, to dream into new possibilities, and to collaborate on what might come next. And that might take some time. But that didn’t happen, and now you’re in a position where you’ve been offered a job and a decision has to be made.

Dawn Serra: To answer your question, you can’t convince him the move would benefit the both of you, because you don’t know that it will. What if he’s miserable in the smaller town? What if he regrets it and begins to resent you? He needs to choose this for himself because it’s a big change. Instead of trying to convince him, I would recommend that you first sit down and ask yourself what is most important to you, Busy Cat? What would bring you the most joy? Then try to work with him to see if you two can make something happen that works for both of you.

Would you be happier if you stayed in London a little longer, turn down the job, and had more time to work with Flavio on alternatives to where you’re living? Maybe dreaming into new possibilities? Or would you be happier to take the job, move to the small town, and then try to find a way to make the relationship work, if possible? You probably have a sense of what would bring you the most joy. If finding jobs in other cities would be fairly easy for you and you value this relationship ahead of that, then maybe now isn’t the time. Maybe down the road, a couple months is the right time. When you have had more time to think about alternatives, to apply for some other things. But if this is a job you’re really excited about, and moving to a smaller town with fewer expenses would bring you a big sense of relief, you need to communicate that with Flavio and ask if he can join you there.

Dawn Serra: It sounds like he wants to be in a big city whether it’s London or another urban area in the U.K. and it sounds like you are hungry for something smaller. Is there a middle ground? Is there a medium sized town on the outskirts of a big city, where the cost of living is cheaper and things move at a slower pace, but you can easily hop on a train and be surrounded by all the big city options 20-30 minutes later? Would you be willing to consider that option and would he?

Sometimes compromise feels important as a way to create new opportunities in a relationship. But sometimes compromise feels bad and it causes a strain that can’t be healed. Sometimes we just reach a point where we’re mismatched. I think, ultimately, you have to ask yourself what it is you want, then you need to ask Flavio what he wants. And if it feels good, spend some time dreaming up possible creative solutions. If there’s a clear way forward, awesome. If there isn’t, then you may be at a point of having to make a tough choice. You’re allowed to want these things – a new job, a less stressful life, cheaper living expenses – all things that will probably improve your mental health. And he’s allowed to not be ready. It doesn’t mean you don’t love each other, that there’s not care there. It just might mean that you want different things.

Dawn Serra: Relationships can certainly survive transitions like this, as uncomfortable as they may be. Relationships can become stronger across a distance. But it is different and it does require effort. But only you know yourself and whether you’d be up for that. Talk to him. If he has trouble making a decision or if he’s really unsure, let him know how much you love him, how much fun you think it would be to go on this new adventure together, invite him to join you. Then leap towards your new life. He will either join you or he won’t, but trying to convince him or force him with lots of arguments if he’s not sure isn’t the way. Because the chance that he’ll resent you later, if things are hard or don’t work out, becomes very high.

I hope you take some time to really think about your pleasure and happiness, and then see what you two can create around that. And if it’s possible to make something happen. Whether this is a new beginning for both of you or just for you, it does sound like you know what you want and now there’s an opportunity to make it happen. Good luck to you, Busy Cat. I hope you two are able to find a way to make it all happen. And no matter what, congratulations on the job proposal!

Dawn Serra: Before we get to this last email for this week’s episode, Patreons, don’t forget. If you support at $5 a month and above, which is $1.25 a week, you not only get to hear bonus content every week but you can also help me answer listener questions. There’s a new listener question that I just posted a couple of days ago that I would love your help in answering. If you support at $3 a month and above, you get access to all kinds of bonus content and there is going to be something going up on Monday of this week for all of you who support the show. So head to patreon.com/sgrpodcast for Sex Gets Real – SGR podcast – and check that out. 

I also want to report, I have a number of super rad interviews officially on the books that are coming up over the next couple of weeks. So you’re going to hear some really, really amazing voices in the coming weeks and months. I’m ridiculously excited about it. So, keep tuning in for that. 

Dawn Serra: Our final email this week comes from Ashamed. It says, 

“Dawn, I’ve been trying to write this email to you for about six months and every time, I lose my nerve and delete it. I found you through your interview with Christy Harrison on Food Psych, and I just don’t know where to turn. I am in a fat body. Saying that is hard for me because I’m really new to fat activism and I’m in recovery for an eating disorder. I face so much stigma already as someone who had an eating disorder that almost killed me while being in a fat body. The abuse I faced from medical professionals was traumatizing. Anyway, my body and I have a tough relationship. Because I’ve been struggling with disordered eating and my body since middle school. I am now in my early 30’s and I know virtually nothing about sex.

I have only masturbated a few times and reaching my genitals is kind of difficult for me because of the size and shape of my body. And I’ve only had sex a few times and I definitely was doing it out of obligation, not because I wanted to or enjoyed it. It wasn’t bad, but it wasn’t great because I just couldn’t be there or asking for anything.”

Dawn Serra: “So here’s why I’m writing to you. I feel ashamed that it’s difficult for me to reach my vulva. I feel ashamed that I don’t know really how to masturbate. I’m scared to try, but after years of avoiding my body, I’m starting to feel ready to try even though I’m really scared about it all. Can you give me some advice or reassure me or something because I get so freaked out and then I avoid it for months before I feel an urge again. Help! How do I masturbate while fat? I’m so ashamed. Thanks for what you do and please be gentle.”

Ashamed! What an extraordinary feat of courage that it took for you to write to me. I really mean that, I promise you. There are so many people who want to write in with their own questions, but who don’t feel ready. And it’s okay to not feel ready, but the fact that you hit send, even while it was scary, is the literal definition of courage! So I want to start by celebrating that.

Dawn Serra: Speaking about our shame is a really powerful thing. Because shame thrives in silence. Shame wants us to hide. It wants us to shrink. It wants us to silence ourselves, to not tell anybody. It tells us that we’re the only one, that we’re worthless. And the fact that you’re feeling shame and still were able to reach out and share, that is a powerful antidote to shame. So that is the definition, for me, of courage and badass. 

I also want to say, thank you for trusting me with this. I love that you found me through Christy’s awesome podcast. For anyone listening, if you haven’t tuned to Food Psych yet, you are missing something amazing. Christy is actually going to be a guest on the show super soon. We’ve got our interviews scheduled and on the calendar, and I can’t wait. 

Dawn Serra: I’m also so sorry, Ashamed, that you experienced so much trauma around your eating disorder. The violence that people in larger bodies face from doctors and eating disorder specialists is real and it’s a special kind of abusive hell. No one should have to experience that. Ever. You can have an eating disorder in any sized body. Anyone who tells you that you should be losing weight when you have an eating disorder– Nope, not okay. That’s violence. You did not deserve what happened to you.But I am happy to hear that you’re in recovery and I hope… I hope so much that that means that you’ve found some support from folks who are affirming of your experiences AND affirming of your body.

The first thing I want to say, there is absolutely nothing wrong with being where you are. You do not have to change. You do not have to force anything. You do not have to push yourself. Sometimes avoiding is exactly what we need as part of our healing. So before we get to anything else, I want to give you permission to sit with the question. Does this feel like something you’re ready for even if it’s scary or a little uncomfortable. Or, does exploring your body and masturbation feel like something you SHOULD do because of external stories or because of shame? If it’s the latter, know that you don’t owe anyone anything around your body and your relationship with it. You’re allowed to not know, you’re allowed to focus on other aspects of your healing and your pleasure. And this doesn’t have to be where you go right now. If it’s the former, and you really do feel like this is an edgy place that might be scary and awkward, but something you’re ready for, then that’s exciting! It’s the beginning of an adventure that you get to create for yourself at whatever pace feels right for you. It’s also OK if you start down this path, and reach a certain point where it feels too triggering, and decide to put it on hold for awhile. Your body and your genitals and your pleasure will be there when you’re ready to circle back. There is no rush.

Dawn Serra: So, let’s talk about pleasure. Because, ultimately, when we’re talking about masturbation, hopefully, we’re also talking about pleasure. For many folks who have experiences with disordered eating and eating disorders, pleasure can be particularly complicated.

Pleasure is one of the most beautiful tools we have for healing, but pleasure isn’t always available to everyone for a variety of reasons. And it’s important that we note that ‘cause so many people treat pleasure as something that we just do. But it can be really difficult. Pleasure happens in the body, in the present moment, so it can be difficult to feel pleasure when we’re outside of ourselves and not really here. Because, maybe it doesn’t feel safe. That’s another piece in this puzzle, our brains can only code something as pleasurable if we are experiencing a certain amount of relative safety. That’s just how we’re wired for survival. It makes sense. If we are in a situation where there’s a chance we’re going to be eaten, then relaxing to feel good and to bring our bodies down and offline probably isn’t the way we survive. So, it makes sense we’re wired that way. But it also doesn’t mean we have to feel totally safe in all the ways, because that’s just not really possible in these mammalian bodies of ours in a world that’s so violent and abusive, where oppression and so many other things exist. But it’s about relative safety. Can we feel safe enough that we can relax a little bit, that we can arrive in the here and now, at least for a little while, and start feeling into some of what’s here?

Dawn Serra: My question is, for you Ashamed, is what is your relationship to pleasure as a whole? This might be an opportunity to go on a quest and to get to know pleasure in all its forms, from the smallest to the biggest. The more we know pleasure in our every day lives, the more pleasure becomes possible in more vulnerable places and situations. Are you able to experience pleasure in the food you eat? Do you enjoy it? Are you able to experience pleasure in the spaces you’re in? What about pleasure and sound? Pleasure and smells? What kinds of movement feel pleasurable, even if it’s something as simple as moving back and forth under the hot water in the shower to feel the temperature changes?

This kind of exploration helps us to start arriving in our body in very gentle ways. Can I feel this cold water on my hands? If I can feel it, do I like it? I might like it now, but not later. That’s important. Can I feel these clothes on my body? If I can, what fabrics do I like best? Where is it really comfortable and where is it uncomfortable?

Dawn Serra: As you start to have this dialogue of noticing and inquiring, it becomes easier when we finally turn our attention towards our genitals. But masturbation does not, I repeat, masturbation does not have to involve our genitals at all! We can get off in so many creative and awesome ways from breathgasms and thinking our way to peaks of pleasure and release via fantasy to touching our breasts or massaging our feet or feeling nails on our back or a flogger. There is SO MUCH PLEASURE available to us that can be erotic, sensual, or even sexual without ever getting our genitals involved. Which means for you, Ashamed, there’s so much to discover long before you ever have to get to your genitals, if you ever get there at all – some people’s most pleasurable experiences have nothing to do with their genitals. And that might be you, too! So let’s talk a bit about masturbation, genitals, and being in a bigger body.

First, this is totally normal. Literally from the beginning of human beings existing on the planet, bodies have come in all shapes and sizes. It is not new that there are fat people, that people are tall or short. Some people in fat bodies carry a lot of their weight in their hips and thighs while others carry a lot of their weight in their chest and arms, others in their belly. Some people have long arms, some people have shorter arms. Some people are really flexible. Some people are not. Besides natural body diversity, that’s not even getting into all the other ways that bodies can be – aging bodies, disabled bodies, from a bad back to chronic injuries, to a huge variety of disabilities, not everyone can reach their genitals with their own hands. And there’s nothing wrong with that at all. It’s just how some bodies are or how some bodies become over time.

Dawn Serra: If reaching your genitals is difficult for you, maybe experimenting with different positions and support would change that. Some pillows or a wedge behind you might give you more reach. That’s a trick of mine that I use, especially when I’m having really bad back days. That gives me an opportunity to touch parts of my body without having to strain. Also, long handled sex toys are your friend. Wands often have long handles and help you to reach all sorts of areas that hands and arms can’t reach no matter what kind of body you’re in. There’s sex furniture that comes in all sorts of shapes and sizes, and some of them allow you to connect sex toys to them for all sorts of fun. Whether you’re touching yourself with your hand or with a toy, one isn’t better than the other. It’s touch and hopefully, you find a way for it to pleasurable. Because this is about pleasure and knowing ourselves, and there’s lots of ways to know ourselves and to experience pleasure.

Some people really get off by humping pillows. They like the pressure and the friction. Other people love the spray of a showerhead on a hose, that they can put in different places of their body. Both of those might be super pleasurable for you, and there’s no need to get a hand on your vulva on either of those cases. Those are just 2 examples, there’s so many others.

Dawn Serra: I think the funny thing about genitals, and bodies in general, is no one – no one knows what your genitals like except for you. You’re the only one that can feel it. The only way to figure it out what feels good, if you want to figure it out, because you don’t have to, is through experimentation.

When we’re experimenting, it’s not only about the mechanics. It’s also about the context and our mental state. I might love a wand vibrator on my clit when I’m in my bedroom after I’ve watched some porn, but that same sensation of the wand might really not be pleasurable and enjoyable if I’m angry or disconnected or in a place that feels uncomfortable or unsafe. I mean, the reality is, sometimes panic attacks hit me right when I’m in the middle masturbating or having sex. And it can feel really frustrating and disappointing. But, I have to stop because it’s too uncomfortable to continue. Sometimes it makes my panic attacks worse. Context matters. Maybe you like a showerhead to masturbate with but only when you’re already really turned on. Maybe you enjoy riding a pillow while you watch porn, so that you can match their movements. Maybe using a toy on yourself feels best after a really long bath and rubbing oils all over your body so that you’re glimmering like a deity in the moonlight. It’s all part of the exploring and the adventure of it all. 

Dawn Serra: I think the really exciting part is that what brings us pleasure changes over time, so we get to be on this curious quest for life. The more that we start developing that practice of being curious about our body, the more opportunities we’re going to have for pleasure throughout the course of our lives. Some people find it helpful to pull out a mirror and actually look at their genitals to get to know them a bit. Other people, it’s less about seeing and more about starting to feel into different sensations and types of arousal, as a way to get to know themselves. There is no wrong way as long as you’re listening to your body and trusting your edges.

Maybe your hand will never really be able to touch your vulva. That is nothing to be ashamed of. Lots of people are in that same position. Sex toys, sex furniture, creativity – all of that can go a long way and there’s no shame in getting help from a professional like a somatic sex educator or a sex worker. Sometimes having someone help us to experiment to find what works, someone who has a lot of experience and who has worked with lots of bodies, is exactly what we need so that we can then go do those delicious things on our own.

Dawn Serra: I would also suggest visiting a feminist sex toy store like Sugar in Baltimore or She Bop in Portland, Shag in Brooklyn, Self Serve in Albequerque, or any number of other shops that are feminist and queer-run. It might feel too scary, because you’re really having a relationship with your shame right now, to walk in and ask for help – face to face, to ask somebody, “Here’s what’s going on for me… What toys would you suggest?” But, you can send an email no matter where you are in the world to one of those awesome shops and ask them for suggestions and toys that might work for you and your body. That’s exactly why they are there. They know so much about their products and which ones might be a great fit for older bodies, or arthritic bodies, or disabled bodies, or trans bodies, and fat bodies, and everything else. 

Asking for help from someone who really knows different toys that are on the market could be exactly what you need to find something that’s a great fit. I would also recommend JoEllen Notte who has this awesome blog called The Redhead Bedhead has so many sex toy reviews, especially wands. JoEllen loves wands. So, you can go there to find a whole bunch of information about wands that often have really long handles. Also, JoEllen has lots of different feminist sex shops featured on her blog. So that can be a way to find some that are maybe closer to you. Elle Chase has a book called Curvy Girl Sex that is all about sex for folks in bigger bodies. Both of those might be helpful resources.

Dawn Serra: Another thing that I highly recommend, and this is for people in any kind of body, but we’re talking about fat bodies today so… I recommend finding some porn that features fat bodies in a non-fetishizing way. There’s some really toxic shit out there where fat folks are being humiliated and really taken advantage of and fetishized in a way that most of us probably wouldn’t find super sexy, especially if we’re new to having a relationship with our bodies. Some people really love it, but I think probably what you might be interested in, Ashamed, is going to somewhere like Crashpad by Pink and White Productions. They have several performers in bigger bodies, and it can be so fun to actually see with your own eyes fat bodies, not only being desired and pleasured, but seeing the ways they use toys on themselves. The ways that they position their bodies, the ways they touch themselves. You do not have to figure this out alone – there are lots of people who are having all kinds of delicious sex in fat bodies who can support you around this and that you can learn from.

I also want to say, if you’d like some professional, personalized support, a sex coach like me or a sex therapist might also be helpful in working through some of the shame and helping you to come up with small, managable steps in exploring your pleasure. Sometimes it really helps to calm that shame to not do it alone. Because you deserve to feel good in this body of yours exactly as it is. You deserve to know your body and to begin to trust it.You deserve pleasure. Your body really is waiting for you and it wants to be heard. You just need to decide what feels available to you right now as you navigate recovery, and then to trust that you have plenty of time to play and experiment and find your way. Because there is nothing wrong with your body or it’s shape, or where you are right now. 

Dawn Serra: Ashamed, I really hope that that helped. If you’d like to explore coaching with me, details are at dawnserra.com. I do have some space in my practice right now. I would love to hear from you. And I want to wish you luck. All of this pleasure awaits! It’s just out there waiting for you to find it. 

Alright, that is it for this week’s episode. Thank you so much for being here with me. Patrons, be sure to head to patreon.com/sgrpodcast tomorrow for this week’s bonus. And if you want to help me field listener questions, that is there, too, if you support at the $5 level. Thank you so much for being here. Have a terrific week and I will talk to you next time. Bye!